Geli and Adolf

Discussions on the role played by and situation of women in the Third Reich not covered in the other sections. Hosted by Vikki.
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Joined: 17 Jan 2009 20:31

Re: Geli and Adolf

Post by palaisfan » 13 Apr 2021 00:54

Helly Angel wrote:
28 Jan 2021 06:12
Cantankerous wrote:
27 Jan 2021 17:36
I watched the documentary "Hitler and Stalin: Roots of Evil" and I found out that Hitler was troubled by the fact that the chauffer with whom Geli Rabaul had a love affair was Jewish. Are there any historians who believe that Hitler killed Geli because she had an affair with the chauffeur?
No. There are many testimonies that break that down. Maurice himself said that in fact AH was about to go to the hands against him enraged when he found out about the affair with Geli, but he only fired him. At the time after Geli's death she returned and AH allowed her to occupy close positions.

There were conspiracies within the party and the SS against Maurice because of his Jewish origin and Maurice had only one defender who protected him and named him "honorary Aryan". His protector was AH.

There are quite a few witnesses that AH was not present in the apartment when Geli shot himself. There are witnesses who were with him, especially Hoffmann and the driver. There is no hint of romance and less of sex between them. If anything, the words he said to Hoffmann that if he married he would be with Geli but he also told him that it would not be possible. The famous romance is the brainchild of Otto Strasser and Shirer, who grossly misrepresents many facts in his books.
Having had cause to re-explore this in puzzling out some of the layout of the Prinzregetenplatz flat, one of the things that is emerging from the circumstances of the suicide is some troubling aspects of both the report and the architecture. The angle of the shot fired seems extremely clumsy, even awkward for either a suicide or an accident. It is usually not given too much weight, but am seriously wondering if some official of the NSDAP or another decided to kill her while Hitler was out of town. (He gets a speeding ticket at 1:37 on the next day hurrying back, so is clearly where he said he was and not involved)

Another thing about it is the close proximity of the main entrance door to Geli's room which can now be reasonably located as beside the 1935 library and is the one window room west of it. If Anni Winter's postwar statement to Musmanno is true she and her husband lived in the southeastern end pair of rooms across from Hitler's bedroom, which would later become the one single room of the big 1935 Dining Room, and Maria Reichert the western end with Geli. (They appear to have shared a Living Room as the two window space there) With a fair sized room separating Reichert's bedroom from Geli, she may have heard very little, just as claimed. What is clear is that the testimony to the detectives was clearly rehearsed and coordinated by the party officials who arrived that morning. This doesn't implicate any of them like Hess or Schwarz per-se, but its pretty obvious that whether a murder or suicide they wanted the story kept short and simple. Almost unbelievably lacking in any real details, with some of the statements almost rote robotic in tone.

The really odd note is anything about Anni Winter's testimony -- it ranges all over the place over time. She tells the detectives she lives off-site but in the Munich address book of 1931 Georg Winter is listed as living there; which is the same thing Anni Winter says post-war to Musmanno -- at the time of the incident they lived in the flat at Hitler's end. As an unrelated example of erratic statements Anni Winter said post-war she had just left his apartment before the Americans occupied it. But Lee Miller's group even photographs her and interacts with her, but apparently she was using the cover name `Frau Gardner'.

If all the testimony is rehearsed or coached, then there really is no way of knowing just who if any were home when it happened, or whether they were sent away. It is notable that if the report was even generally right as to how long she had been lying there, the incident happens a little before the 5pm alleged departure of Winter would have occurred. As for Hitler, he would be just as at the mercy of what he was told the next day as the detectives were.

Not really saying anything about this one way or another --- just throwing it out there as had never noticed the discrepancies until started reconstructing the layout of the flat as an old puzzle. Its equally possible it was simply a suicide after all and there is some explanation -- as yet undiscovered -- for the very odd downward trajectory of the shot.

- palaisfan

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Re: Geli and Adolf

Post by mhammedali21 » 15 Jun 2021 15:06

It turned into rumored that Eva Braun had discussed Geli with others after she have become concerned with Hitler, that she changed into in his eyes " a substitute " for her ... That he never overcame her demise. I assume even their marriage in the long run become no longer a lot love but his way of thanking her for her devotion and willingness to proportion his fate.

Also, prior to conflict in 1939, it became informed later that every xmas eve, Hitler could go back to the rental and lock himself in Geli's room looking to be by myself :(

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