Bauformen

Discussions on the fortifications, artillery, & rockets used by the Axis forces.
jopaerya
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Re: Bauformen

Post by jopaerya » 19 Dec 2013 19:14

Hello Friends

(1) Do you five of these tobruks ?
(2) A "normal" 2 cm Flak 30 or 38 does not fit in the tobruk
(3) Any of these tobruks left
(4) Sorry for the many questions

Regards Jos
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der bunkermann
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Re: Bauformen

Post by der bunkermann » 19 Dec 2013 23:02

Hi jos.
1 i'm not sure if they were all the same.

2 Strange a normal 2 cm dont fit?
3 18 and 19 still excist, but the bettungen are completely covered.
4 my finger hurts :lol:

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AW
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Re: Bauformen

Post by AW » 20 Dec 2013 08:09

Moin,

I think only No. 20 and maybe 21 are from this design...
all the other one had a seperat UK & M.
sadly No. 20 is demolished.

btw. what are BRV R1, R2 and R3?

greetz
Alex

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AW
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Re: Bauformen

Post by AW » 24 Dec 2013 18:27

jopaerya wrote: (2) A "normal" 2 cm Flak 30 or 38 does not fit in the tobruk
Regards Jos
Hello,

the opening Looks bigger than a Bf 261 (70)... if the drawing are right is the Diameter 6,60m
My opinion is that the le Flak are for "Erdkampf" because it was infront of the Höckerline/Pz-Graben.

greetz

Alex

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der bunkermann
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Re: Bauformen

Post by der bunkermann » 24 Dec 2013 21:40

Hi alex, R2 is possible something to do with the cables that connected the complex with the V192 in westbroekpark.
R3 is a tobruk. I think it was 58c.
Gr. Tim.
R1 is not on the map?

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AW
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Re: Bauformen

Post by AW » 25 Dec 2013 10:04

Hello Tim,

thx... I wonder that the Tobruk isn´t on the german map?!
R1 was is the KSS at Willem Beukelzoonstraat.

greetz
Alex

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der bunkermann
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Re: Bauformen

Post by der bunkermann » 25 Dec 2013 13:50

Aha.. i have a drawing of the schaltstelle somewhere. Send it to you.
I remember that tobruk was temporarily open some years ago.

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der bunkermann
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Re: Bauformen

Post by der bunkermann » 25 Dec 2013 13:54

Also where the lonely 4 is on the map (below r2) there should be a tobruk.

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Eax-E
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Re: Bauformen

Post by Eax-E » 11 Apr 2014 21:38

Hello,

Here is a good hint to find "who" is the BF 85. It must be an observation post with workroom.
VF remplacé par BF.jpg
Regards
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jopaerya
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Re: Bauformen

Post by jopaerya » 12 Apr 2014 07:51

Nice find Arthur
:thumbsup:

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dirk Peeters
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Re: Bauformen

Post by dirk Peeters » 19 Apr 2014 01:55

Yep i agree , nice find
Dirk

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moonraker
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Re: Bauformen

Post by moonraker » 26 Feb 2017 14:13

hello,
here one foto of VF1a ...
source ebay.de

Me belfra-team
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forttravel
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Re: Bauformen

Post by forttravel » 11 May 2018 11:26

Almost typical Ringstand 58c, but only partially (on top = beam section) with iron reinforcement.
Please note on drawing label, both names existing together Ringstand and Tobrukstand.
Also new function/armament = Panzerbüchse and observer.
Source: http://www.gahetna.nl/collectie/archief ... level/file
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forttravel
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Re: Bauformen

Post by forttravel » 11 May 2018 14:49

MG-Stand Typ 5 from designed im year 1943.
Quite deep inside 130 cm from floor to top edge with big diameter of wooden pole in the middle. AA purpose for hmg or light cannon?
Some source as above.
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Lars Bertelsen
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Re: Bauformen

Post by Lars Bertelsen » 13 May 2018 11:39

Thanks forttravel
Almost typical Ringstand 58c, but only partially (on top = beam section) with iron reinforcement.
Very interesting drawing. It seems to be a Bauform 58c build using the minimal amount of reinforcing bars.
In Denmark (and other placed, I guess), lots of Bauformen were built without rebar in the external walls. To ensure, that the strength of the wall would not be reduced, the thickness of the walls was increased by 50 % (60 cm instead of 40 cm as usual). Nevertheless, today these walls often have got large cracks or sometimes even collapse under their own weight (see attached photo of Bauform 67 variant at Blåvand). The bottom plate and roof plate were usually built in normal thickness and reinforcement (20 cm and 40 cm respectively).
The Bauform 58c on your drawing seems to be built without reinforcement in the bottom plate and only a minimum in the roof plate. Thicknesses are increased by 50 % (30 cm and 60 cm respectively), and the stair case has got an extra step. I wonder if any Ringstände were actually built in this way.
Greetings Lars
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