Unknow gun

Discussions on the fortifications, artillery, & rockets used by the Axis forces.
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VRIL7
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Re: Unknow gun

Post by VRIL7 » 09 May 2021 14:10

nuyt wrote:
08 May 2021 22:32
You can still find many HIH Siderius picturess I collected on the new Overvalwagen Forum (except the old article):
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/theover ... -t167.html
Hi Nuyt,
Thanks for the link. It turns out that you are the author of the Overvalwagen forum. My regards. Through this website, I learned that Holland, before World War II, had its own artillery systems. Thank you.
nuyt wrote:
08 May 2021 22:32
Exact dimensions will be difficult for these two guns anyway (and they were never used, just prototypes).
Do you have the technical characteristics of these antiaircraft guns?
Also interested in the history of creation. Why were they not adopted by the Dutch army? Although they look quite modern.
And another question - does the 8-cm anti-aircraft gun of 1927 look different in design than in 1933, and did they have the same caliber (in fact, 78-mm)? I read somewhere that later, they switched to 75mm for export.
Regards
VRIL

nuyt
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Re: Unknow gun

Post by nuyt » 09 May 2021 16:19

The Dutch Army tested a lot of AA guns in this cal range (7,5-8 cm) from Schneider, Bofors, Vickers, HIH Siderius. Though they were interested in helping a national armament company, by the time they made the decision of a weapon HIH Siderius was gone. In 1934 they turned to Vickers.

Where did you read that they "switched to 75mm"?

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Re: Unknow gun

Post by nuyt » 09 May 2021 16:31

shultz wrote:
07 May 2021 21:02
Hi ,
I have had this clipping for many years, it is from a magazine (RID Italian Defense Magazine of 1983).IMG_20210507_145230_2.jpg

The photo shows Italian soldiers (Alpini) on the Russian front in 1942; you see an 81 mortar and a 47/32 gun.
In the middle is an object that looks like an artillery piece, I couldn't figure out what it is.
Nobody distinguishes what is it? Thanks for any help.
Regards, Shultz
Since they are Alpini: the only weapon I can think of is the Obice da 75/13?
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VRIL7
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Re: Unknow gun

Post by VRIL7 » 09 May 2021 19:56

nuyt wrote:
09 May 2021 16:19
The Dutch Army tested a lot of AA guns in this cal range (7,5-8 cm) from Schneider, Bofors, Vickers, HIH Siderius.
In this case, I am only interested in HIH Siderius.
nuyt wrote:
09 May 2021 16:19
Where did you read that they "switched to 75mm"?
Here: https://strangernn.livejournal.com/674071.html
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VRIL

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VRIL7
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Re: Unknow gun

Post by VRIL7 » 12 May 2021 19:28

https://collectie.nmm.nl/nl/collectie/detail/378974/
I think on this site the blueprint is mistakenly signed as a 6 cm anti-aircraft gun. After all, it is clearly visible that this is an 8-cm anti-aircraft gun of 1933.
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VRIL

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T. A. Gardner
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Re: Unknow gun

Post by T. A. Gardner » 13 May 2021 02:46

shultz wrote:
07 May 2021 21:02
Hi ,
I have had this clipping for many years, it is from a magazine (RID Italian Defense Magazine of 1983).IMG_20210507_145230_2.jpg

The photo shows Italian soldiers (Alpini) on the Russian front in 1942; you see an 81 mortar and a 47/32 gun.
In the middle is an object that looks like an artillery piece, I couldn't figure out what it is.
Nobody distinguishes what is it? Thanks for any help.
Regards, Shultz
I'd say it is a Skoda 75mm Model 15 mountain howitzer. It was a pretty common weapon in Italian use as the Obice da 75/13. The dead straight, short gun barrel and square shield are definite fits.

shultz
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Re: Unknow gun

Post by shultz » 13 May 2021 13:20

nuyt wrote:
09 May 2021 16:31

Since they are Alpini: the only weapon I can think of is the Obice da 75/13?
T. A. Gardner wrote:
13 May 2021 02:46

I'd say it is a Skoda 75mm Model 15 mountain howitzer. It was a pretty common weapon in Italian use as the Obice da 75/13. The dead straight, short gun barrel and square shield are definite fits.
Hi guys,
it is not possible that it is a 75/13 Skoda M. 15 (official Italian name).
IMG_20210507_145230_3.jpg
It is clear that there are two trail legs and two spades, while the 75/13 has a box trail; furthermore, the shield is too small and in one piece, while that of the 75/13 is much larger and divided vertically into two halves (and therefore if it had been hit it would have split in two).
It looks like a small anti-tank piece .....
Nothing, the mystery remains.
Thanks anyway .
Shultz
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nuyt
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Re: Unknow gun

Post by nuyt » 13 May 2021 15:03

Sorry, Shultz, I dont get it. I do not see spades but ammo boxes.

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Re: Unknow gun

Post by shultz » 13 May 2021 17:11

nuyt wrote:
13 May 2021 15:03
Sorry, Shultz, I dont get it. I do not see spades but ammo boxes.
Hi Nuyt,
I had thought of ammunition boxes too, but there are no weapons there that can use them: the metal boxes for the 81 mortar bombs and the 47/32 ammo boxes are very different.
There are no machine guns in the photograph, but the wooden boxes for the Breda 37 strips are also different (higher).
The 75/13 ammo crates are made of wood and much larger.
I do not know.....
Regards, Shultz

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T. A. Gardner
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Re: Unknow gun

Post by T. A. Gardner » 13 May 2021 17:20

nuyt wrote:
13 May 2021 15:03
Sorry, Shultz, I dont get it. I do not see spades but ammo boxes.
I agree with this. The two boxes are not spades as they are not inline with the gun. There is also that bar sitting on top of them that's likely a tool or something. I'd say ammo boxes is a more likely explanation.
There are several variants on the shield on a 75/13 and that appears to fit one version. The barrel is obviously thick, cylindrical without taper, and quite short. The clearly rules out any sort of anti-tank gun. If it is a 75/13, which I think it is, and it has the small spoked wheels, it would look as it does.
The boxes could easily be a couple of ammo cases like the one shown here stacked up.

Image

nuyt
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Re: Unknow gun

Post by nuyt » 13 May 2021 19:03

Indeed. I also think the Obice is possibly without its wheels (after all it was pack) and resting with the front of the box trail carriage on the earth. There is dirt below the shield and between the ammo boxes, so the lower end of the box trail might be resting on the floor of the dugout or hanging on the edge (so the crew sit in the dugout. The shield might be non regular one, field adaptation perhaps.

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VRIL7
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Re: Unknow gun

Post by VRIL7 » 15 May 2021 16:37

Hello everybody,
Who can identify this anti-aircraft gun?
Thanks.

unknown gun.jpg
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VRIL

Clive Mortimore
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Re: Unknow gun

Post by Clive Mortimore » 15 May 2021 16:59

VRIL7 wrote:
15 May 2021 16:37
Hello everybody,
Who can identify this anti-aircraft gun?
Thanks.


unknown gun.jpg
British 3 inch 20 cwt Anti Aircraft Gun on a Mobile mount Mk1 in travel position. It appears to been abandoned and someone has elevated the gun, it could neither fire or travel as in the photo.
Clive

shultz
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Re: Unknow gun

Post by shultz » 15 May 2021 17:01

nuyt wrote:
13 May 2021 19:03
Indeed. I also think the Obice is possibly without its wheels (after all it was pack) and resting with the front of the box trail carriage on the earth. There is dirt below the shield and between the ammo boxes, so the lower end of the box trail might be resting on the floor of the dugout or hanging on the edge (so the crew sit in the dugout. The shield might be non regular one, field adaptation perhaps.
Hy Nuyt, that's not a 75/13!
I know this Skoda howitzer very well personally, there is a piece in the museum of my city (and I have helped to restore it) and there are others within a few kilometers from my house; and I can rule that "the thing" is NOT a 75/13, even if reduced to scrap .
I'm sorry, the mystery still remains .

Regards, Shultz

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VRIL7
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Re: Unknow gun

Post by VRIL7 » 15 May 2021 19:24

Clive Mortimore wrote:
15 May 2021 16:59
British 3 inch 20 cwt Anti Aircraft Gun on a Mobile mount Mk1 in travel position. It appears to been abandoned and someone has elevated the gun, it could neither fire or travel as in the photo.
Thanks Clive!
Regards
VRIL

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