German planning concerning the armored counteroffensive in Normandy

[Michael Kenny]

What struck me was the paucity of 'Normandy' related titles and in particular from the Allied side. All that stood out was Reynolds and in terms of 'leaning' I put his efforts on a par with Meyer's 12th SS history.

[Aida1]

What struck me was the paucity of 'Normandy' related titles and in particular from the Allied side. All that stood out was Reynolds and in terms of 'leaning' I put his efforts on a par with Meyer's 12th SS history.

Meyers history is a very well written one. Better than most divisional histories. Obviously you do not like Reynolds. Military professionals have generally a high regard for the german army which you cannot accept .
Where Normandy is concerned i have enough books including a few non german like Hill 112 by Major How. It is only one campaign in a much larger war and there are a lot of other interesting periods in military history.

[Mori]

Some divisional histories go beyond their own formation and actually analyse the campaigns. One of the more interesting ones I have read was the history of the 116th Pz Div. At some point the author (who served as an officer in said division) not only criticized the higher comand (OB. West and HGr. B) but even his own divisional command.

It's true. I read this one and it's as good as it gets.

However, large parts were also so close to the KTB (which I accessed too) that it made me doubt whether there was any capacity to step back and reflect on what happened.

[Mori]

You got to love how certain posters always manage to derail topics in order to make it all about themselves - and no, Mori, I am not talking about you.

I'm pretty happy I could make Aida do exactly what I wanted him to

[Mori]

What struck me was the paucity of 'Normandy' related titles and in particular from the Allied side. All that stood out was Reynolds and in terms of 'leaning' I put his efforts on a par with Meyer's 12th SS history.

The British / Canadians tend to have analytic titles more than the Americains. I'm thinking of Stephen Hart's Colossal Cracks, David French's Raising Churchill's army, John Buckely's British Armour in the Normandy Campaign and Monty's men, Terry Copp's Fields of Fire etc.
(I haven't kept with latest research and more may have been published over the last 5 years).

[Westphalia1812]

What struck me was the paucity of 'Normandy' related titles and in particular from the Allied side. All that stood out was Reynolds and in terms of 'leaning' I put his efforts on a par with Meyer's 12th SS history.

David French's British Armour in the Normandy Campaign,

Isn't that one by Buckley too?

[Michael Kenny]

David French's British Armour in the Normandy Campaign



Isn't that one by Buckley too?

Conflation..

[Michael Kenny]

Obviously you do not like Reynolds. Military professionals have generally a high regard for the german army which you cannot accept .
Where Normandy is concerned i have enough books including a few non german like Hill 112 by Major How. It is only one campaign in a much larger war and there are a lot of other interesting periods in military history.

You lack the ability to fact-check Reynolds and thus are in no position to comment on his veracity. If someone had asked me which 'Normandy' books you had then given your myopia I would have bet good money How's 'Hill 112' would be the type you seek out.
I said early you would have very few books/references from the Allied side and everything you have posted (so far)completely validates my claim.

[Mori]

What struck me was the paucity of 'Normandy' related titles and in particular from the Allied side. All that stood out was Reynolds and in terms of 'leaning' I put his efforts on a par with Meyer's 12th SS history.

David French's British Armour in the Normandy Campaign,

Isn't that one by Buckley too?

Fixed.

[Mori]

If you had bothered to look; you would have seen all the texts i translated and posted on this forum.. I got thousands of images of NARA captured german records on my computer which i ordered from digital history archive. Just bought some directly from NARA the last few days.

"Thousands" of images is not impressive, given than one single roll typically holds 1,200 pages. So you are just saying you got 2 rolls.

Actually, i have 9 so more than 10.000 images. And i am looking for specific informations on german armored tactics mostly.

How impressive. Nine rolls. Found on wwiidigitalarchives.org, I suppose (most of what DHA offers is also on that site).

[Aida1]

Obviously you do not like Reynolds. Military professionals have generally a high regard for the german army which you cannot accept .
Where Normandy is concerned i have enough books including a few non german like Hill 112 by Major How. It is only one campaign in a much larger war and there are a lot of other interesting periods in military history.

You lack the ability to fact-check Reynolds and thus are in no position to comment on his veracity. If someone had asked me which 'Normandy' books you had then given your myopia I would have bet good money How's 'Hill 112' would be the type you seek out.
I said early you would have very few books/references from the Allied side and everything you have posted (so far)completely validates my claim.

Given your bias against germans which you can hardly deny , your credibilty is very low. It is not surprising you are very selective also where non german authors is concerned. Your myopia is well proven therefore even where them is concerned .I suppose the recent Bloody Verrieres by Arthur W.Gullachsen for example will also seriously irritate you given its subject. Gullachsen is a canadian officer with far more credentials than you. Given the political correctness of german historians you would probably like some of them better.
Anyway, it is my choice to have an interest in armored warfare of which the battle of Normandy is not really an example given the terrain so there are far more interesting campaigns to look at in ww2 and after.
And you cannot escape the glaring hole in all your arguments which is that if the germans were as bad as you pretend, then the german defenses would have collapsed just as fast as the Iraqi defenses collapsed during Desert storm.

[Aida1]

If you had bothered to look; you would have seen all the texts i translated and posted on this forum.. I got thousands of images of NARA captured german records on my computer which i ordered from digital history archive. Just bought some directly from NARA the last few days.

"Thousands" of images is not impressive, given than one single roll typically holds 1,200 pages. So you are just saying you got 2 rolls.

Actually, i have 9 so more than 10.000 images. And i am looking for specific informations on german armored tactics mostly.

How impressive. Nine rolls. Found on wwiidigitalarchives.org, I suppose (most of what DHA offers is also on that site).

I am looking for experience reports on the tactical use of german armor so i am very selective in what i get.
Silly to try another pissing contest over numbers of NARA rolls. And childish

[Georg_S]

Please stay on topic, and those who have been challenged to prove their opinion with facts. Please do that, otherwise I will lock this thread.

/Georg

[Aida1]

2) How much did they really protest to Hitler?
For example, there is meeting with AH just after the fall of Cherbourg. AH comes to shout on his generals for losing the port. Was that the relevant time to put up requests? Some post-year testimonies say they did, but this is doubtful.
(Same goes with a guy like Model: contrary to his reputation, he never argues against AH).

You got your chronology wrong. Hitler came to Margival on june 17 long before the fall of Cherbourg. During this meeting Rommel and Rundstedt requested authority to allow bigger movements. It was proposed to pull back the forces of Army group G to the north and set up a new defenseline from the swiss border -Saone, Loire -Seine estuary or from the swiss border over Saone-Marne-Somme. Hitler rejected these proposals(Ose pp 132-133).
There was another meeting on the Obersalzberg on june 29 and 30 after the fall of Cherbourg (Ose p158) just before the situation reports with propoals to give up terrain which led to Rundstedt being fired(Ose 152-159).

[Westphalia1812]

Given the political correctness of german historians you would probably like some of them better.

How many modern German studies have you read to back up that claim?