Syrian campaign 1941 and german support, info needed please

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Joda
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Syrian campaign 1941 and german support, info needed please

Post by Joda » 14 Jul 2022 15:38

From June 8th to July 14th 1941 there was the so called "Syrian Campaign", that followed the Irak campaign on May.
Does anyone know something about the german military (small) force under Gen. Meyer Ricks during this Syrian campaign?
It looks they secretly supported the Vichy forces against the British, but I cannot find any source that explain their role during this period.

Hope someone helps... ;)

Many thanks in advance

Marco

CogCalgary
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Re: Syrian campaign 1941 and german support, info needed please

Post by CogCalgary » 14 Jul 2022 16:01

Who was that French member 13meuble or something like that?He seemed to have good resources there.Havent seen his posts in some time.

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Loïc
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Re: Syrian campaign 1941 and german support, info needed please

Post by Loïc » 14 Jul 2022 17:30

From May 15, the base of Aleppo-Nerab-Nord was only occupied by French maintenance personnel, by the servants of the anti-aircraft battery of 75 taken from Beirut and by the French members of the squadron of Potez 63 to six planes which provide protection. The Nerab-Sud barracks were occupied by several hundred Germans and Italians, Von Manteuffel demanded a daily supply of 10,000 liters per day of gasoline, but the needs will only increase to reach 24,000 liters per day, but the German manpower increases, occupying the southern camp, part important from the base. Luftwaffe mechanics as well as basic maintenance personnel which must represent more than 200 military

The Germans were not only in Mosul or Syrian airbases. They consider unworthy the obligation not to appear in uniform and to be concentrated in the mediocre barracks, like captives. Those in Beirut are agitated, including two delegates from the Abwehr; Major Arnold and Captain Rosen contact the most outrageous nationalists. They want to distribute weapons, in secret from the French, to monitored nationalists like Choukri Kouatli and the Emir Adel Arslan. They want to bring in about twenty officers to frame these conspirators, Rahn will learn, will oppose this coming and any distribution of weapons. Only Major Meyer-Ricks will settle in Beirut, within sight of Dentz.

Colonel von Manteuffel, designated as head of a Verbindungskommando (liaison detachment) settles in Alep-Nerab. This detachment includes 7 officers including 1 from the Abwehr. It was even planned that Sonderstab F military mission placed under the orders of Air Force General Felmy would settle with a staff in Aleppo. Its rather improvised action was in fact based on the hope of a prolonged resistance of Iraq. Neither Germany, in full preparation for Barbarossa (the attack on Russia), nor Italy were capable of mounting a major operation.
For his part, Rahn suggested to the Foreign Ministry in Berlin that he be appointed German Consul General in Beirut. General Dentz briefed by Rahn got scared and begged Darlan to intervene.

Finally, on May 17, Rahn suggested to Berlin that Major Meyer-Ricks be sent to Beirut. Which was done since he flew to Beirut, accompanied by two Luftwaffe officers. Rahn in one of these reports had proposed to keep an entire coastal zone in Lebanon to constitute a possible starting base in the event of intervention in the Middle East.

on May 31, 1941, General Dentz was once again put to the test. German Colonel Jung is in Aleppo, in uniform, and reports military collaboration decided at the level of the German and French governments. Dentz hastened to alert Admiral Darlan. Hence a series of unnumbered telegrams, sent by Comar Beirut as well as a response from Darlan reporting no military collaboration.

But the Germans present in Syria seem to be seeking all means to remain. Thus, this telegram from Dentz for the cabinet of the minister n° 241-2/20 of June 8 at midnight:
“I am advised from source R. that Colonel Manteuffel would be maintained with a reduced staff with the mixed delegation for Syria. I have the honor to urge that this project not be pursued because of the repercussions on public opinion which would infer that the German commander has not given up using bases in Syria. It had been understood that keeping R. would avoid the presence of German officers and the CDA had admitted that none would appear in Beirut. Signed: Dentz. »

So here is the admission that there are indeed German officers installed in Beirut with the Italian armistice commission; that even if the Germans leave Syria, Rahn will remain there with all his entries to the High Commissioner. To do what ?

in Aleppo, the discussion resumed between French and German soldiers at 10 p.m. Jannekyen supported by Rahn declares that the Iraqi enterprise is a failure for the Germans with the risk of a violent British reaction if the Germans cling in Syria. Similarly, the French will no longer have any confidence in their word. Then everyone goes to bed. But on June 1 at 7 a.m., the commander of the base in Aleppo warns that this time a German general has just landed. This is Felmy, commanding the German troops in Crete. New meeting at 9.15 a.m. in Aleppo. General Felmy announces that he has come to the site to find out. Rahn explains that the French troops are nervous and that there is a risk that their state of mind will change. Remaining in Syria could lead to a second German failure after that of Iraq, unless this new operation is undertaken only with sufficient forces, a secure line of communication, therefore through Turkey, and assured supplies. General Felmy agrees but says he is staying in Aleppo for the time being. Jannekyen leaves for Beirut to present his report to Dentz.

On June 7, a telegram from Wiesbaden to war DSA n° 20318/EM at 6:55 p.m. specifies: “As a result of the change in the situation, the special tasks of the German liaison detachment with the Italian delegation in Syria disappear. As a result reduction of staff. This seems to prove that Germans were in Beirut, near the Italian armistice commission, which is confirmed by another telegram written by the Germans.

This document was followed on June 8 by the telegram of the German Armistice Commission, Wehrmacht/Ia to the French delegation:
“To respond to the wishes of the French government and the High Commissioner in Syria, the Wehrmacht High Command has decided, after further examination, to completely withdraw the German liaison detachment from the Italian delegation of control. The liaison detachment has been ordered to leave Syria urgently. Signed: Bohme. »

Darlan confirms to Dentz twice that there is no Franco-German collaboration agreement against the English.

Colonel von Manteuffel left Syria on June 9, 1941. For twenty-four hours, the English and Free French forces had crossed the Lebanese and Syrian border and faced the Vichy military forces


L’Armée Française et les Etats du Levant
Maurice Albord CNRS Editions

Joda
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Re: Syrian campaign 1941 and german support, info needed please

Post by Joda » 14 Jul 2022 18:38

Loïc wrote:
14 Jul 2022 17:30
From May 15, the base of Aleppo-Nerab-Nord was only occupied by French maintenance personnel, by the servants of the anti-aircraft battery of 75 taken from Beirut and by the French members of the squadron of Potez 63 to six planes which provide protection. The Nerab-Sud barracks were occupied by several hundred Germans and Italians, Von Manteuffel demanded a daily supply of 10,000 liters per day of gasoline, but the needs will only increase to reach 24,000 liters per day, but the German manpower increases, occupying the southern camp, part important from the base. Luftwaffe mechanics as well as basic maintenance personnel which must represent more than 200 military

The Germans were not only in Mosul or Syrian airbases. They consider unworthy the obligation not to appear in uniform and to be concentrated in the mediocre barracks, like captives. Those in Beirut are agitated, including two delegates from the Abwehr; Major Arnold and Captain Rosen contact the most outrageous nationalists. They want to distribute weapons, in secret from the French, to monitored nationalists like Choukri Kouatli and the Emir Adel Arslan. They want to bring in about twenty officers to frame these conspirators, Rahn will learn, will oppose this coming and any distribution of weapons. Only Major Meyer-Ricks will settle in Beirut, within sight of Dentz.

Colonel von Manteuffel, designated as head of a Verbindungskommando (liaison detachment) settles in Alep-Nerab. This detachment includes 7 officers including 1 from the Abwehr. It was even planned that Sonderstab F military mission placed under the orders of Air Force General Felmy would settle with a staff in Aleppo. Its rather improvised action was in fact based on the hope of a prolonged resistance of Iraq. Neither Germany, in full preparation for Barbarossa (the attack on Russia), nor Italy were capable of mounting a major operation.
For his part, Rahn suggested to the Foreign Ministry in Berlin that he be appointed German Consul General in Beirut. General Dentz briefed by Rahn got scared and begged Darlan to intervene.

Finally, on May 17, Rahn suggested to Berlin that Major Meyer-Ricks be sent to Beirut. Which was done since he flew to Beirut, accompanied by two Luftwaffe officers. Rahn in one of these reports had proposed to keep an entire coastal zone in Lebanon to constitute a possible starting base in the event of intervention in the Middle East.

on May 31, 1941, General Dentz was once again put to the test. German Colonel Jung is in Aleppo, in uniform, and reports military collaboration decided at the level of the German and French governments. Dentz hastened to alert Admiral Darlan. Hence a series of unnumbered telegrams, sent by Comar Beirut as well as a response from Darlan reporting no military collaboration.

But the Germans present in Syria seem to be seeking all means to remain. Thus, this telegram from Dentz for the cabinet of the minister n° 241-2/20 of June 8 at midnight:
“I am advised from source R. that Colonel Manteuffel would be maintained with a reduced staff with the mixed delegation for Syria. I have the honor to urge that this project not be pursued because of the repercussions on public opinion which would infer that the German commander has not given up using bases in Syria. It had been understood that keeping R. would avoid the presence of German officers and the CDA had admitted that none would appear in Beirut. Signed: Dentz. »

So here is the admission that there are indeed German officers installed in Beirut with the Italian armistice commission; that even if the Germans leave Syria, Rahn will remain there with all his entries to the High Commissioner. To do what ?

in Aleppo, the discussion resumed between French and German soldiers at 10 p.m. Jannekyen supported by Rahn declares that the Iraqi enterprise is a failure for the Germans with the risk of a violent British reaction if the Germans cling in Syria. Similarly, the French will no longer have any confidence in their word. Then everyone goes to bed. But on June 1 at 7 a.m., the commander of the base in Aleppo warns that this time a German general has just landed. This is Felmy, commanding the German troops in Crete. New meeting at 9.15 a.m. in Aleppo. General Felmy announces that he has come to the site to find out. Rahn explains that the French troops are nervous and that there is a risk that their state of mind will change. Remaining in Syria could lead to a second German failure after that of Iraq, unless this new operation is undertaken only with sufficient forces, a secure line of communication, therefore through Turkey, and assured supplies. General Felmy agrees but says he is staying in Aleppo for the time being. Jannekyen leaves for Beirut to present his report to Dentz.

On June 7, a telegram from Wiesbaden to war DSA n° 20318/EM at 6:55 p.m. specifies: “As a result of the change in the situation, the special tasks of the German liaison detachment with the Italian delegation in Syria disappear. As a result reduction of staff. This seems to prove that Germans were in Beirut, near the Italian armistice commission, which is confirmed by another telegram written by the Germans.

This document was followed on June 8 by the telegram of the German Armistice Commission, Wehrmacht/Ia to the French delegation:
“To respond to the wishes of the French government and the High Commissioner in Syria, the Wehrmacht High Command has decided, after further examination, to completely withdraw the German liaison detachment from the Italian delegation of control. The liaison detachment has been ordered to leave Syria urgently. Signed: Bohme. »

Darlan confirms to Dentz twice that there is no Franco-German collaboration agreement against the English.

Colonel von Manteuffel left Syria on June 9, 1941. For twenty-four hours, the English and Free French forces had crossed the Lebanese and Syrian border and faced the Vichy military forces


L’Armée Française et les Etats du Levant
Maurice Albord CNRS Editions
Thanks a lot!

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Re: Syrian campaign 1941 and german support, info needed please

Post by CogCalgary » 14 Jul 2022 20:03

Joda wrote:
14 Jul 2022 15:38
From June 8th to July 14th 1941 there was the so called "Syrian Campaign", that followed the Irak campaign on May.
Does anyone know something about the german military (small) force under Gen. Meyer Ricks during this Syrian campaign?
It looks they secretly supported the Vichy forces against the British, but I cannot find any source that explain their role during this period.

Hope someone helps... ;)

Many thanks in advance

Marco
My understanding is that the Italians were also supporting the French with an unknown number of Italian commandos.They were present at the Litani River on June 7 or 8 iirc.

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Loïc
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Re: Syrian campaign 1941 and german support, info needed please

Post by Loïc » 15 Jul 2022 01:42

It is not question to support the French who didn't ask or wish to see nor germans nor italians, but for their own interests in the Middle East, these last ones having already a sub-commission of armistice in Beyrouth to control the French and promote pro-Axis anti-french propaganda as well as both occupiying powers had others in French Overseas territories since the Armistice to do the same
to the German presence, will be added that of Italy. On May 12, the DSA by telegram n° 815 let it be known that the Italians had decided to send an air group to Iraq to make a stopover in Syria. On May 21, Dentz asked to suspend. But, on the 22nd, Turin announced for the next day the landing in Aleppo of 15 CR 42 aircraft and an S 81, with provision of 14,000 liters of gasoline. The Italian aircrafts seem to have mainly served to mark the affirmation of Italian aims in the Middle East.
General Huntziger writes in his personal notes dated June 2: “Iraq is deflating, I insist that the Germans and Italians empty the Levant as soon as possible. Darlan agrees; action taken immediately. What will now become of our relations with the British in the Levant? »

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Re: Syrian campaign 1941 and german support, info needed please

Post by Joda » 15 Jul 2022 10:29

Loïc wrote:
14 Jul 2022 17:30


......

Colonel von Manteuffel left Syria on June 9, 1941. For twenty-four hours, the English and Free French forces had crossed the Lebanese and Syrian border and faced the Vichy military forces


L’Armée Française et les Etats du Levant
Maurice Albord CNRS Editions
Does this book explain something about Gen.Meyer Bricks on June 20th?
Inside the NARA roll about Sonderstab F, it's reported that on June 20th he flew to Beirut toghether with a small military staff in civil wearings , but armed. What about this event?
I suppose that they were "supporting" the Vichy government (or better the german interest) against the British?

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Re: Syrian campaign 1941 and german support, info needed please

Post by Joda » 15 Jul 2022 15:24

Here it is :
59E99AE5-698A-4616-8056-376E052A1DBF.jpeg
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Re: Syrian campaign 1941 and german support, info needed please

Post by CogCalgary » 18 Jul 2022 15:25

Loïc wrote:
15 Jul 2022 01:42
It is not question to support the French who didn't ask or wish to see nor germans nor italians, but for their own interests in the Middle East, these last ones having already a sub-commission of armistice in Beyrouth to control the French and promote pro-Axis anti-french propaganda as well as both occupiying powers had others in French Overseas territories since the Armistice to do the same
to the German presence, will be added that of Italy. On May 12, the DSA by telegram n° 815 let it be known that the Italians had decided to send an air group to Iraq to make a stopover in Syria. On May 21, Dentz asked to suspend. But, on the 22nd, Turin announced for the next day the landing in Aleppo of 15 CR 42 aircraft and an S 81, with provision of 14,000 liters of gasoline. The Italian aircrafts seem to have mainly served to mark the affirmation of Italian aims in the Middle East.
General Huntziger writes in his personal notes dated June 2: “Iraq is deflating, I insist that the Germans and Italians empty the Levant as soon as possible. Darlan agrees; action taken immediately. What will now become of our relations with the British in the Levant? »
IIRC,an SM 81 can carry almost 40 paratroopers.

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Re: Syrian campaign 1941 and german support, info needed please

Post by CogCalgary » 18 Jul 2022 16:13

The Palestine Post,8 June 1941 has a good summation.

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Re: Syrian campaign 1941 and german support, info needed please

Post by Joda » 18 Jul 2022 16:17

Which was the role of Rick's staff in Siria from June 20th? Until then they stayed there?
It's a very little known part of history of the Syrian campaign on June-July 1941.
Obviously they were there "hidden" under civil looks...

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Re: Syrian campaign 1941 and german support, info needed please

Post by CogCalgary » 18 Jul 2022 18:18

Joda wrote:
18 Jul 2022 16:17
Which was the role of Rick's staff in Siria from June 20th? Until then they stayed there?
It's a very little known part of history of the Syrian campaign on June-July 1941.
Obviously they were there "hidden" under civil looks...
In that June 8 Palestine Post under Hundreds Of Planes And Technicians

It states that many Germans walk about in shorts disguised as sportsmen.
It also says that an informant stated that German pilots manned French aircraft that brought down a British bomber near Aleppo.

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Re: Syrian campaign 1941 and german support, info needed please

Post by Loïc » 18 Jul 2022 20:01

All this german italian presence is seen as all but positively and all but a "support" for French military of Levant, rather a threat for French colonial interests from both hostiles powers having their own agendas and ambitions in the area
Major Hermann Meyers-Ricks is presented as a specialist and connoisseur of Arabs affairs and Muslim World, he came in the context of german intelligence and interests in the Middle East with the Anglo-Iraqi war, activing connections with arab nationalists under French British Empire in order to support Iraq and arabs against the colonial powers

USArchII, T77, R1432, F690, Cable 197 to Berlin and Special Command F: five hundred to a thousand al-Qawuqji men mobilized and need more weapons, discussion with Shammar leader in ar-Raqqa and Palestinian leader in Aleppo regarding anti-British uprising, will return today to Beirut, June 29, 1941, signed Meyer-Ricks, Rahn; F662, report by Meyer-Ricks on Syria, British steps and guerilla warfare by Arabs, and Vichy and Lebanon, June 22, 1941–July 4, 1941, Beirut, July 4, 1941, signed Meyer-Ricks; F691,

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Re: Syrian campaign 1941 and german support, info needed please

Post by CogCalgary » 19 Jul 2022 04:47

The French were not happy about playing second fiddle to the Germans.Suddenly the soldiers were mortal enemies and took opportunity for cruel treatment of captured soldiers.The Italians used Capsicum on a captured French commando to gain information. Very bitter feelings on the part of the Italians.

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Re: Syrian campaign 1941 and german support, info needed please

Post by Joda » 19 Jul 2022 11:38

Loïc wrote:
18 Jul 2022 20:01
All this german italian presence is seen as all but positively and all but a "support" for French military of Levant, rather a threat for French colonial interests from both hostiles powers having their own agendas and ambitions in the area
Major Hermann Meyers-Ricks is presented as a specialist and connoisseur of Arabs affairs and Muslim World, he came in the context of german intelligence and interests in the Middle East with the Anglo-Iraqi war, activing connections with arab nationalists under French British Empire in order to support Iraq and arabs against the colonial powers

USArchII, T77, R1432, F690, Cable 197 to Berlin and Special Command F: five hundred to a thousand al-Qawuqji men mobilized and need more weapons, discussion with Shammar leader in ar-Raqqa and Palestinian leader in Aleppo regarding anti-British uprising, will return today to Beirut, June 29, 1941, signed Meyer-Ricks, Rahn; F662, report by Meyer-Ricks on Syria, British steps and guerilla warfare by Arabs, and Vichy and Lebanon, June 22, 1941–July 4, 1941, Beirut, July 4, 1941, signed Meyer-Ricks; F691,
Sounds good many thanks ;)

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