Top Secrets in Ludwikowice/Ludwigsdorf

[LWD]

Please learn to read a bit better to avoid subjecting us to more of your misunderstandings.

....
Neutron emissions (gamma radiation) can be stimulated at very low energies.

Abstract. Evidence of x-ray and neutron emission from an ultraminiature pinch plasma focus is presented. .... X-ray radiographs of materials of different thickness were obtained. Neutrons were detected using a system based upon 3He proportional counter in current mode...

....The Thermonuclear Plasma Department of the Chilean Nuclear Energy Commission (DPTN-CCHEN) has in the last years worked in the miniaturization of neutron generators based on plasma focus (PF) physics as non radioactive sources of neutrons. .... These very small devices produce pinch plasmas, neutrons and X-rays pulses.

Source
APPLIED PHYSICS LETTERS VOLUME 83, NUMBER 16 20 OCTOBER 2003
- Neutron emission from a fast plasma focus of 400 Joules

Patricio Silva, Jose ́ Moreno, Leopoldo Soto,a) Lipo Birstein, Roberto E. Mayer,b) and Walter Kiesc) Comisio ́n Chilena de Energ ́ıa Nuclear, Casilla 188 D, Santiago, Chile

Note that it mentions x-rays and neutrons. That implies that they are distinct i.e. not the same .i.e. different.
Neturons are not gamma radiation. Netrons have mass. Gamma rays do not.

Not sure what your point is about low energy stimulated emission of neutrons is. Given that natural emissions occur I'd take low energy stimulated emissions as a given.

Also note that this quote contradicts some of your earllier statements as to the source of various types of radiation. Indeed your statment about neutrons being gama rays when combined with your statement about gama rays being "natural" rather conflicts with them being generated artifically as indicated in the quote.

You're getting almost as good at proving yourself wrong as I am at proving you wrong. Keep it up and I won't have to post much more than smilies.

[LWD]

Thanks for the quotes. So it sounds like it is possible to use x-rays in the energy range mentioned to knock neutrons out of Beryllium atoms. It's not clear of those neutrons are in the range of energies needed to convert Thorium 232 to Thorium 233. Furthermore it's not clear if said conversion process if possible is at all practical. Looks very questonable to me at best. Certainly not "blindingly obvious" as some have stated.

Thorium 232 struck by a slow neutron transmutes to Protactinium 233, not into Thorium 233.

Not what it says in the reference above indeed it exlicitly states:

when 232
Th captures a neutron (whether in a fast reactor or thermal reactor) to become 233
Th.

Indeed if you are famliar with the topic at all you will no that adding a neutron to the nucleaous of an element does not change the element.

Yes the addition or ejection of a neutron changes the isotopic state. The addition or emission of a proton changes the element.

Which doesn't conform to your statemt above.

IF LWD questions the energies involved are competent perhaps he should refer us to papers backing up his reservations as they appear based largely on humbug.

Not how it works on this board. You are the proponent I've questioned your statement it's up to you to back it up.

n + 232Th = 233Th - ß = 233Pa - ß = 233U
The chain which you demand evidence of is already in the Thorium fuel cycle link at Wikipedia which you have already referred us all to above.

That statmenet in no way addresses the energy of the neurtron.

Actually in this case you make the assertion that it can't possibly be so therefore I require you to justify it with something more substantial LWD that your usual humbug. Of course as we all know, the real truth is you can't back up your dismissal.

It would help if you kept enough of the material to know what your are talking about. If it is the following:

I'm going to need a source for that. As stated it's rather counter intuitive as well so you may wish to clarify your statement a bit.

Then your statement is fallacious if it refers to another statment of mine PLS produce the one you are refering to.

Do I wish to clarify?
Not really. If you can't keep up then that's your problem.

So you produce a statment that is at best ambigous and refuse to support it. Well I guess that's one way to stop digging.

LWD wrote:X-ray Neutrons??? Pa -233 is indeed a decay product of Thorium 233 but "X-ray Neutrons"?
Neutrons can be released from Beryllium atoms by treatment with hard X-Rays, I'm sure this is meant here.

Selective memory loss LWD ?

Not at all. You were the one that brought the topic back up again and continued to refer to "X-ray neutrons". If you accepted his hypothesis there was no reason to bring it up but you clearly didn't and made a fool of yourself mixing up electromagnetic radiation and particulate radiation.

Beryllium cannot sustain a reaction but when bombarded with neutrons it emits far more than received. That's self explanatory. ...

That's a rather different statment than the 4:1 statement you made previously. Not that I still don't want to see asource.

[verloren_aviator]

Since when? Care to document that? I just checked a bunch of web sites and the majority directly refer to x-rays as being electromagnetic raidation of photons. None of them refer to it as being particulate radiation such as a neutron.

Happy to educate you,,,

That will be the day.

Clearly you have little grasp of nuclear physics otherwise you would be aware that Gamma radiation concerns the emission of neutrons.

I may not have a phd in physics but I've clearly a much better understanding of it than you do.
[/quote]

The following says it all....

LWD has carefully avoided enlightening us any further on his previous comment that Uranium 233 obtained from the natural Beta decay of Protactinium 233 requires any further "enrichment"

This is a positive assertion that Uranium 233 needs further enrichment therefore i repeat my previous two requests that LWD provide us with a source to back his claim?

But I do thatk you for many endless hours of entertainment Larry.

If you don't understand that Gamma rays are neutron emissions then I suggest you don't have a moment to lose. I would start work on that PHD while you still can.

[LWD]

... If you don't understand that Gamma rays are neutron emissions then I suggest you don't have a moment to lose. I would start work on that PHD while you still can.

Gamma rays ar e neutron emissions??? As stated that is meaningless. Gamma rays can and I believe usually are emitted when a neutron breaks down into a proton and electron. They can also be emitted along with a neutron from an atomic nuclei. There are however a number of other mechanisms by which they can be emitted. This hardly takes a PhD but seems to be beyond you.

[goldlover]

Hi

I have just read "the last alchemist" on kindle - it is all about this and is a brilliant book.

I the die glocke is capable of vortex compression and magnetic field separation and uses tons of electricity - sound a bit like a stargate (as seen on TV), or a time machine.

I think that's where some of these top people disappeared to.

Incidentally there is now evidence that Hitler did not die until he was in his late 80s and lived out his life after the war in a small village in the Soviet. This was on a train programme done by Chris Tarrent and he actually spoke to an elderly gentleman that knew him; a few of the villagers also remembered him, but did not know who he was fully until he had lived there a number of years.

If you can imagine something then it is possible, there are more things in this universe than we will ever know.

[Simon Gunson]

Witnesses with sources



Die Glocke (informal name) arises from a real high voltage particle accelerator project located inside the decommissioned Wenceslas coal mine near the village of Ludwigsdorf ( renamed as Ludwikowice after the forced expulsion of Germans by Poles in 1945).

Dr Kurt Debus who worked on NASA's Apollo Moon mission also worked on die Glocke experiments at Wenceslas

Debus described the Bell April 22, 1943 Foreign Scientist Case Files, K Debus NARA/RG 28, US Nat. Archive, College Park, Maryland USA.

Witnesses to the Nazi Bell:s

SS Lieutnant General Jakob Sporrenberg, Police Chief (ie Gestapo) Lublin (occupied Poland) who was extradited from Norway then interrogated after the war before his execution for war crimes in 1947.

SS Hauptsturmfuhrer Rudolf Schuster, cited from an interrogation report archived at Berlin Document Centre testified about evacuation of the Bell by air in 1945 aboard a Ju390 aircraft flown to Bodo, Norway. image:(present day Bodo airport was home in WW2 to Ju-88 bombers and Ju-87 Stuka) [source Bell evacuation flight noted in Farrell, Joseph. Giza Death Star Deployed, pp 115-130, based upon report of SS Hauptsturmfuhrer Rudolf Schuster's interrogation, Berlin Document Centre]



present day Bodo:

Argentine Economic Ministry report which was only declassified in 1993. referred to a “Bell” device being flown to El Palomar air force base near Buenos Aires in July 1945 where it was unloaded. Prior to declassification of Polish intelligence archives in 1998 there was no widespread knowledge, or mention of the Nazi Bell , thus the Argentine report was an entirely independent corroboration of Sporrenberg, Schuster and Voss. The Ju390 was flown to to Paysandu, Uruguay, where it was broken up
Argentina’s Economic Ministry compiled a report in 1945, which asserted the Nazi Bell was flown as cargo inside the Ju390 to to El Palomar air force base Buenos Aires.

Dr Wilhelm Voss, Chief Executive of Skoda Works, Czechoslovakia in his 1974 account was given to Tom Agoston: British Journalist Agoston interviewed Kammler's boss in charge of the SS Skoda works, Dr Wilhelm Voss. His guest; Voss, was unaware of the testimony from either Schuster, or Sporrenberg, told Agoston about the Ju-390 flight from Schweidnitz to Bodo and described the Bell being flown out on the Ju390. Voss had been in hiding at Agoston's lodgings seeking to avoid indictment at Nuremberg. Voss later became involved in Nazi gun running to Palestinians through Syria after WW2.

Soviet plasma physics scientist Dr. G.N. Frolov in a 1983 interview referred to Prof [Baron]Graf Manfred von Ardenne as a first hand witness. Ardenne, drove Russian investigators from Dresden to the Wenceslas mine and advised them of the Nazi Bell project.

Dr Otto Cerny (whilst working at NASA postwar, also recounted the Nazi Bell to a young Greg Rowe) [source Stevens, Henry (2007) Adventures Unlimited Press. Hitler's Suppressed and Still Secret Weapons, Science and Technology. pp.251-255 ]

Railway employee from Opole, Joachim Ibrom, a shunting train driver who shunted a high voltage transformers on wagons inside the mine where it connected to the so called "Nazi Bell" by cable to an electrical power supply outside the mine. Ibrom recounted after each experiment all the wagons had to be destroyed because they were fiercely radioactive Ibrom said the wagons were gas torched to prevent their reuse and dumped as scrap. From Ibrom we have description that the "Bell emitted an eerie glow.

[Simon Gunson]

Hi

I have just read "the last alchemist" on kindle - it is all about this and is a brilliant book.

I the die glocke is capable of vortex compression and magnetic field separation and uses tons of electricity - sound a bit like a stargate (as seen on TV), or a time machine.

The claim above is postwar American Disinformation from the Compton Committee, designed to obfuscate the real (nuclear) purpose.
The real purpose of die Glocke was that, Nazi Germany was enriching Uranium using Gas Centrifuges, with electromagnetic separation by Betatrons. The depleted Uranium238 from Uranium enrichment was being transmuted at Wenceslas mine to harvest Neptunium 239.

Neptunium 239 decays into Plutonium 239. therefore die Glocke played an important role in efforts by the SS to develop a nuclear weapon.

I think that's where some of these top people disappeared to.

Incidentally there is now evidence that Hitler did not die until he was in his late 80s and lived out his life after the war in a small village in the Soviet. This was on a train programme done by Chris Tarrent and he actually spoke to an elderly gentleman that knew him; a few of the villagers also remembered him, but did not know who he was fully until he had lived there a number of years.

If you can imagine something then it is possible, there are more things in this universe than we will ever know.

Incorrect, Hitler was flown to Madrid via Barcelona 27 April -30 April 1945 where Hitler hid under the name Adi Lupi at el Prado palace, Madrid. Hitler died from a massive coronary on 2 November 1947. He never went to South America. There were huge disinformation campaigns by various parties aimed at misleading the Soviets, for the simple reason that Hitler had discreetly negotiated his escape with western Allies who gave the Nazis time to hand over technology, scientists & engineers before the final collapse of Nazi Germany.

Why else do you think ALSOS were free to roam deep inside German lines unopposed, unless the Nazis cooperated?

[Ponury]

Incorrect, Hitler was flown to Madrid via Barcelona 27 April -30 April 1945 where Hitler hid under the name Adi Lupi at el Prado palace, Madrid. Hitler died from a massive coronary on 2 November 1947. He never went to South America. There were huge disinformation campaigns by various parties aimed at misleading the Soviets, for the simple reason that Hitler had discreetly negotiated his escape with western Allies who gave the Nazis time to hand over technology, scientists & engineers before the final collapse of Nazi Germany.

Why else do you think ALSOS were free to roam deep inside German lines unopposed, unless the Nazis cooperated?

And what about the accounts of the people from the bunker about Hitler's presence there also on April 27-30, 1945? So many would lie? The NKVD after the war also harshly interrogated them, camps and what, they continued to lie? Your story about Madrid, etc., hardly sticks to the truth. No confirmation of Hitler's departure from Berlin. Pilot Hanna Reitch is also lying?

[Simon Gunson]

... If you don't understand that Gamma rays are neutron emissions then I suggest you don't have a moment to lose. I would start work on that PHD while you still can.

Gamma rays ar e neutron emissions??? As stated that is meaningless. Gamma rays can and I believe usually are emitted when a neutron breaks down into a proton and electron. They can also be emitted along with a neutron from an atomic nuclei. There are however a number of other mechanisms by which they can be emitted. This hardly takes a PhD but seems to be beyond you.

Neutrons do not "break down into Protons & electrons," That is a nonsense!
Gamma rays are bursts of energy given off when a neutron sheds from the nucleus,

All of which are irrelevant to nuclear transmutation.

Graf Manfred von Ardenne operated an electromagnetic Uranium isotope separation laboratory in Dresden. On 10 May 1945 he was visited by NKVD Colonel General V. A. Makhnjov, and was then accompanied by the Russian physicists Isaak Kikoin, Lev Artsimovich, Georgy Flyorov, and V. V. Migulin as they drove to the Wenceslas mine at Ludwigsdorf, where Ardenne showed them over his particle accelerator at the mine ( from an article citing an interview with Georgy Flyorov, published in 1983)
The fact that Nazis were using particle accelerators for nuclear transmutation is confirmed by Soviet physicist Georgy Flyorov.

Transmutation can occur in in a particle accelerator when bombardment causes the nucleus to shed a Proton
When 238U is bombarded by particles of sufficient energy it will alpha decay to 234Pa. This then Beta decays to Uranium 234.



Thorium 232 undergoes similar transmutation in the presence of alpha emitter Beryllium in a particle accelerator.