German sentinels & motorcyclists in stupid WW movies

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Joshua Keppler
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German sentinels & motorcyclists in stupid WW movies

Post by Joshua Keppler » 25 Oct 2002 11:02

In stupid WWII movies, all the German sentinels are smoking cigarettes just before they are killed. The killer mainly uses a knive, cutting the poor German throat from behind. In other bad movies, they use to mock on the German motorcyclists. In fact, those units were elite assault troops. I remember a lot of movies with clever Americans hunted by German motorcyclists. The action ussually takes place in occupied France, Belgium, whatever. The motorcyclists are shooting 1 million round, with no effect. In the end, all of the motorcyclists are plunging in water or off-road. The end

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Post by Mike R » 26 Oct 2002 03:08

Don't forget the thrilling motorcycle chase in "Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade"!!!! :D

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-Mike

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Post by Logan Hartke » 26 Oct 2002 03:23

Wow, Joshua, I guess I don't watch the same WWII movies that you do. The most famous German motorcycle chase outside of Indiana Jones in cinematographic history was the motorcycle chase in The Great Escape. In that movie, Steve McQueen (representing one of three Americans amongst a bunch of stuffy Brits, is a famous motorcycle racer turned pilot turned POW. He manages to bring down one German motorcyclist (by stringing wire across the road) and he then steals the motorcycle. The first German soldier that he comes to suspects him and it is a series of failed bluffs and escapes until he is caught not long after. The German troops in that movie (with the exception of Fritz I think it was) are all portrayed as fairly intelligent. They are at least as intelligent as the majority of their counterparts. That's probably second most famous motorcycle chase scene with Nazis in history, and only one of them die or is injured and only two Nazi motorcycles crash. They are fast and stay hot on his heels most of the time.

Image

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Oberst Klink
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Post by Oberst Klink » 26 Oct 2002 06:01

i think the key word here is: movie.

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HPL2008
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Kradschützen

Post by HPL2008 » 26 Oct 2002 13:27

"Indiana Jones And The Last Crusade" was extremely entertaining and I've always liked it, and of course it should not be taken too seriously. But still, that motorcycle chase, thrilling and excititing as it was, was totally stupid indeed. The silliest thing is the German motorcyclist who, for some reason, attacks the Joneses' bike by slamming his own front wheel down on the back of it. What's that supposed to be? Why the hell doesn't he just shoot them?!?
(Bit of trivia by the way: Did you notice that right after that chase, when Indy and his Dad discuss their further action at that crossroads, the sign there says "Venedig" when we first see it but "Venice" in the following close-up?)

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kobold
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Re: German sentinels & motorcyclists in stupid WW movies

Post by kobold » 26 Oct 2002 20:08

Joshua Keppler wrote:The motorcyclists are shooting 1 million round, with no effect

There are a few types of "hollywood" ammunition:-

The Kennedy bullet
This amazing round when fired from an allied (usually american) gun, can often hit more than 1 target, or travel round corners, giving a lone american with just a pistol, the same firepower as a full infantry squad.


The "A-Team" rounds.
"A-Team" rounds, when fired, do no damage at all to soft targets like human beings - they are designed to only damage hard surfaces like windows, bottles, cars etc.
As troops are not told they have been given these rounds, when they see their shots are having no effect on their targets, they always decide to fire more and more -resulting in many broken windows, bottles, shot car tyres, etc.

The "Infinite" bullet
This micro sized round can be used in any weapon, by allied or axis troops.
Basically, because of its small size, even a pistol can fire for many minutes without needing to be reloaded.
This round has been available since the days of the old west, when a lone cowboy would kill a gang of 30 outlaways with one loaded pistol.



I'm sure there are more types out there... :)


Dave

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Christian Ankerstjerne
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Post by Christian Ankerstjerne » 26 Oct 2002 20:14

Yes, I just saw a movie, where a revolver fired 8 shots... (and it obviously only had 6...)

But in the end, it is hard to hit anything from a moving motorcycle, driving on a not-so-paved road, I'd suspect.
The motorcyclists were very vulnerabvle, and many were KIA.

Christian

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Romulus
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Post by Romulus » 26 Oct 2002 23:54

Steve McQueen only agreed to do that movie if he could show off his motorcycle skills :lol:

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Post by Joshua Keppler » 27 Oct 2002 10:18

What about "Where eagles dare" (starring Richard Burton and Clint Eastwood)? It has a tremendous beginning (with good music) and a pathetic end (I mean the motorcycle pursuit). The Germans in the moto seem to posses an MG -42, much more superior than Clint Eastwood's MP 40. Yet, guess who "hits the dirt" in the end? I guess not Eastwood... The Germans are shooting from 20 meteres with their MG-s, but manage only to break windows and drive tiny holes in the snow-bus (which is red - an easy target on white snow).

In reply to Logan: All respect to tour point of view. I admitt I did not see that movie. The problem is that I spend my childhood during the most severe years of the communist regime in Romania. The cinemas where all filled with Soviet and Chinese movies. Once in a while, there were some American movies (war movies with only bad German motorcyclists). My favourite movie (when I was 10 yrs old): The guns of Navarrone (despite some stupid sentinels being killed....)

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Post by Caldric » 27 Oct 2002 22:15

Joshua Keppler wrote:What about "Where eagles dare" (starring Richard Burton and Clint Eastwood)? It has a tremendous beginning (with good music) and a pathetic end (I mean the motorcycle pursuit). The Germans in the moto seem to posses an MG -42, much more superior than Clint Eastwood's MP 40. Yet, guess who "hits the dirt" in the end? I guess not Eastwood... The Germans are shooting from 20 meteres with their MG-s, but manage only to break windows and drive tiny holes in the snow-bus (which is red - an easy target on white snow).
But why in the hell would you kill off your hero? Imagine reading a book, say fantasy, and 1300 pages later he dies the quest is not finished and the world is destroyed....

The point is this is fiction, nor is it some movie to make Germans out to be sharpshooters.

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Post by Joshua Keppler » 28 Oct 2002 12:15

Hello, Caldric. Of course, you are right about the fiction, but why in the hell the heroes never die in movies? They only die in breaking news and very, very little movies (the good ones). Take for instance a good movie: "The Iron Cross". Steiner dies in the end (well, you don't see the bullets driving holes in his body, but that's the final message). In another good movie (from that point of view) - Saving Private..., the most charismatic characters, played by Hanks and Sizemore, die also. The idea is that it becomes boring to see a war movie, being sure from the very beginnig who dies and who not. And I also hate the scenes in which the bad guys shoot from 5 meters and miss. Not to mention other stupid scenario: the bad guy, behind a loaded weapon, gets the good guy cornered. The good guy is helpless, staring at the gun. The bad guy does not pull the trigger, he begins to talk. And he talks, and he talks, untill he gets killed by another good guy that talks very little in the movie. I know, you will mention again about reality and fiction, but my point is the following: is it really necessary to repeat and repeat all over again this clichees in movies? All respect, best regards.

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Post by Caldric » 28 Oct 2002 19:29

Joshua Keppler wrote:Hello, Caldric. Of course, you are right about the fiction, but why in the hell the heroes never die in movies? They only die in breaking news and very, very little movies (the good ones). Take for instance a good movie: "The Iron Cross". Steiner dies in the end (well, you don't see the bullets driving holes in his body, but that's the final message). In another good movie (from that point of view) - Saving Private..., the most charismatic characters, played by Hanks and Sizemore, die also. The idea is that it becomes boring to see a war movie, being sure from the very beginnig who dies and who not. And I also hate the scenes in which the bad guys shoot from 5 meters and miss. Not to mention other stupid scenario: the bad guy, behind a loaded weapon, gets the good guy cornered. The good guy is helpless, staring at the gun. The bad guy does not pull the trigger, he begins to talk. And he talks, and he talks, untill he gets killed by another good guy that talks very little in the movie. I know, you will mention again about reality and fiction, but my point is the following: is it really necessary to repeat and repeat all over again this clichees in movies? All respect, best regards.
That is true, I did not think of it in those terms. Although those movies may rank as a tragedy.

I thought SPR was a pretty realistic movie, had many innovative filming techniqes, touched on issue's rarely if ever covered in a US war movie. They brought blood and graphic violence right into the theater, good or bad it was trying to be reality. All good to me, I never once thought the Germans were weak, actually my wife who hated the movie because of the violence (I talked her into going to see it with me not knowing) made the statement that the Germans were really tough, and it must have been hell to fight there.

Now that is the average uninformed "not wanting to be informed" persons opinion. I know no one that would go away from the movie thinking the Germans were stupid or weak etc.

I think many of these statements about Germans being shown as idiots are not exactly true, I am sure some movies are like that no doubt, but if they want to make Germans the heros I would suggest to Germans to go make a film themselves.

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Post by Joshua Keppler » 29 Oct 2002 10:12

Hello, again Caldric. You are right about "Saving..." As far as I know, this movie completely changed the way in which the American WWII movies had been made before. In my opinion, the problem with that movies was not showing the Germans being stupid (well, let's admitt, you must be stupid to fight aganist USSR and USA and think of winning!!!). The problem was showing the Americans (and Allied soldiers, generally) going at war like walking in the park. The very original "D-day" movie showed a John Wayne acting like a cowboy on the beaches, chewing gum and spraying bullets. The Allies were too much self-confident. The good thing with "Saving..." was showing that the men involved in the conflict (americans, brittish, germans etc) were all pissing with fear in combat. Spielberg's creation was great by showing clearly how the very first GIs were slaughtered like pigs, in their crowded landing boats. This reality was never shown in the "old" WW II movies. By the way I recomend to all of you a French film "Le Miserables", starring Jean Paul Belmondo. Well, the script is based upon Victor Hugo's novel (with Jean Valjean, inspector Javert, little Cossette etc), BUT THE ACTION TAKES PLACE DURING D-DAY!!! There is one of the most sugestive scenes I have scene in a movie, regarding The Allied invasion. Some French peasants are drinking wine and chatting on the terrace of a pub. It's well passed after midnight. Above them, some white gliders cut the dark skies, silently. No one hears them, no one see them. They are flying to their objectives, while the ignorant peasants still drink their wines, without knowing what major event is under development just above them. I say this is one of the most strong and suggestive scenes of the invasion ever seen in a movie.

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Post by Oberst Klink » 29 Oct 2002 12:10

saving... blatantly rips off the great movie Beach Red (1967) which is an excellent film for the time about the Marines invading Iwo Jima.

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Post by Caldric » 30 Oct 2002 18:18

Oberst Klink wrote:saving... blatantly rips off the great movie Beach Red (1967) which is an excellent film for the time about the Marines invading Iwo Jima.
Did the makers of this movie own WWII or something? If the Marines were landing at Iwo Jima how did they rip it off? And what is the difference between landing at Iwo or Normandy?

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