A "What IF" Ambush of the USS Saratoga

Discussions on alternate history, including events up to 20 years before today. Hosted by Terry Duncan.
robdab
Member
Posts: 762
Joined: 30 Mar 2007 15:45
Location: Canada

Re: A "What IF" Ambush of the USS Saratoga

Post by robdab » 25 May 2020 18:48

T. A. Gardner wrote:
25 May 2020 05:17

The entrance to San Diego harbor is a very easy and straight forward one. Until you pass Point Loma you can be steaming at whatever speed you like so long as you are in the marked (by buoy) channel. As you pass Pt. Loma, you reduce speed and continue to do so until you are slowed where you won't leave a wake as you pass North Island on your starboard side.
Almost two NM beyond the end of the channel marked on the chart I provided, the ocean is less than 75 feet deep (10 to 12 fathoms) per charts (I have the charts for San Diego Bay). Adjacent to Pt. Loma there is a submerged jetty with a light at the end on the opposite side of the channel.
The ocean to either side of the channel is less than 200 feet deep outside this area, much of it less than 100 feet. Also, as marked on charts there are anchorages (the circles) off North Island and the Silver Strand for ships that are waiting to enter. Some of these are frequently occupied by merchant ships waiting their turn to dock at one or another pier.
So, you have several submarines maneuvering in shallow water among commercial traffic along with civilian craft and who knows what naval vessels besides Saratoga trying to line up a shot on the carrier without being detected.

This is not what I'd call a good plan.
Thanks for your input TA but until I can locate the appropriate charts that I can actually SEE, I won't be able to comment intelligently on your posting. Later ...

Richard Anderson
Member
Posts: 3066
Joined: 01 Jan 2016 21:21
Location: Bremerton, Washington

Re: A "What IF" Ambush of the USS Saratoga

Post by Richard Anderson » 25 May 2020 21:23

I'm sorry all, indeed I should have followed my own advice and not participated in this nonsense. I also will not provide any sources for robdab and will happily remove my reply.
"Is all this pretentious pseudo intellectual citing of sources REALLY necessary? It gets in the way of a good, spirited debate, destroys the cadence." POD, 6 October 2018

robdab
Member
Posts: 762
Joined: 30 Mar 2007 15:45
Location: Canada

Re: A "What IF" Ambush of the USS Saratoga

Post by robdab » 25 May 2020 21:53

Richard Anderson wrote:
25 May 2020 21:23
I'm sorry all, indeed I should have followed my own advice and not participated in this nonsense. I also will not provide any sources for robdab and will happily remove my reply.
A shame really. Richard usually KNOWS his stuff cold, backwards AND forwards … and I was looking forward to learning lots more from him about WW2 Bremerton too !

Ah well, he just doesn't play well with others, or is it just with me ? Its ONLY a discussion about a partially fictional story, so why get all worked up about it ?

I wonder if its actually "WON'T provide a source for robdab", or instead "CAN'T provide a source for robdab" ?

He's been expressing hatred for my "historical factoid" based AH discussions for about a decade now but usually he puts up a better fight … sad.

User avatar
Terry Duncan
Forum Staff
Posts: 5787
Joined: 13 Jun 2008 22:54
Location: Kent

Re: A "What IF" Ambush of the USS Saratoga

Post by Terry Duncan » 25 May 2020 22:56

As the warning I posted earlier this morning was not even vaguely taken notice of, this thread is now locked. Further instances of trolling or name calling will result in warnings or bans to be considered by senior moderation staff. Further examples of such posting will be removed entirely so as not to litter the board with locked topics. If people cannot learn to follow the rules they will find their time here could well be limited.

Terry Duncan

Return to “What if”